In this Growing Business Faster podcast episode, Matt Coffy talks to Stephen Christopher about what it takes to build a high revenue generating marketing agency fast and how you can do the same thing.
Matt Coffy: Alright. Hey I'm very excited today. This is one of those podcasts as I get to do. I’ve got Stephen Christopher on and he's had a couple of different agencies. He's got Seequs today, his main gig. Say hi, Steve.
Stephen Christopher: Hey Matt. How are you? Thanks for bringing me on the show.
Matt Coffy: You're welcome. We're sort of at the same level of agency size. We’re around that million-dollar mark, but this is your second agency. You’ve had some other businesses. The cool thing is that you grew this one really fast, and I’m beyond tickled to find out how in under basically two years you've got to a million-dollar company. I’m sure some of the listeners who are plugged into this right now are curious as well. We've had some other folks that have been on the agency world in our podcast that have got substantial sized agencies. We've talked to a couple. But they mainly have been sort of midstream. So this is interesting to talk about how you built this so quickly. But our main thrust today is to talk about motivation and maybe that ties into like how you got to get there so quickly. Could you take us back in 2014 when you started and how things looked and then just maybe bridge us through sort of like a six-month clip on how things extended and how quickly and why you grew so fast more than how you grow as fast? But I think there's got to be some motivation behind this.
Stephen Christopher: Yeah sure so in May of 2014 I sold my previous agency to pretty much exit a business partnership, and then in may I started day one and all I had was a name that my girlfriend and I had actually come up with on a bar napkin over a beer at Chili's. So the structure when I started Seequs looked like me with zero clients because I couldn't take any of our existing clients from my previous agency and that was it. I mean I didn't have any real plan when I started. I think the I think some of the best information that I had that allowed me to grow so quickly is I had the previous five or six years from my last agency. I knew everything that I didn't want to do and I had a list of all the things that I wanted to change in the previous agency, but we had grown a little too big. I mean we were only about 15 people. But, Matt, as you know even as you get a couple people it's difficult to make some changes within the company structure, culture, I mean just how you do everything. So I was fortunate enough to get to hit the reset button but at the same time I can tell you or anybody that started a business you know I mean when you're there sitting at a desk by yourself and you have nobody to help, you're doing all the work, you're trying to get all the customers, it can be daunting and sometimes a little disheartening even.
Matt Coffy: Yeah there's so much. I mean on a daily basis, this route I call it the roller coaster ride of life. I swear like last Friday I was on the top of the world and you come in on Tuesday and you're still at the top of the world. By Wednesday I have hit the bottom and it's like what happened? Why is everybody mean today?
Stephen Christopher: Yeah. You know it's funny you mentioned roller coaster and kind of that description that you just said. Have you ever read the book Double Double by Cameron Harold?
[clickToTweet tweet="'The universe wants us to win and the only time we don't win is when we get in our own way.' @StephenMChris" quote="'The universe wants us to win and the only time we don't win is when we get in our own way.' -Stephen Christopher"]
Matt Coffy: I've heard of it. It's my one want-to-read list.
Stephen Christopher: Cool. Yeah I would recommend it to any business owner because, for those of you who don't know, he's the guy, the COO that grew 1800 junk from like two million to 180 eighty million in a very short amount of time. He talks about the roller coaster ride of a CEO, and it's exactly what you just said.
Matt Coffy: Yeah. It's funny. We get back from like Memorial Day weekend and it’s a very happy and a great time. With the customers it's like almost traditional the Wednesday after Memorial Day they all come running back because they've all forgotten that they're supposed to do and then they come back. You blame, point fingers, or whatever but just stuff needs to get done and everybody was kind of sort of delaying things. So you went from this napkin drawing of a business to now in the last two years to 80,000. What was the main thing that drove your revenue? What do you think was the main factor? Because that's a lot of accounts to be built in a short period of time. I'm assuming that we're talking about the small business profession, chiropractor, plumber, blah blah blah type of business.
Stephen Christopher: Yeah. I mean we have, I don't know, right now between 35 and 40 clients. Those are our main revenue driving clients. We have a couple other smaller ones and then we get revenue from our web development side. But I would say one of the big things that drove our revenue was really putting together a solid product and it was something that I hadn’t done in the past. When I would go out and sell because I was the primary salesperson in both the current company and my past one, it would kind of be based on what that client’s needs were but it was loosely put together and we would kind of ala carte everything. So it just didn't feel like that was right. I talked to a couple of my other friends that own much larger agencies, actually Jeff Lee Herman which you interviewed not too long ago, I saw in your podcast, that's one of them. So I talked to these guys said, “Here's where I am. Give me some give me a little bit of direction on how you got from four million to 20 million.” That consistently kind of came up. So I created a much more kind of strict list of services. So we really only have like three levels of packages that we offer to people, and from an SEO standpoint the SEO is all the same even from the basic one, but we started to do all these other add-ons that we found we were good at and we were doing for some clients. Like one of my account managers would be doing something for his client just because he felt like that was right, but the other account manager didn't even know he was doing it and neither did I, and it was a huge value add and it was getting a lot more leads for our for the client. So I said, “Okay let's sit down and figure out everything we're doing for all clients, and then put them into three nice little packages.” And now we really have something that we're great at so we can continually get better and better within those packages and then we can continue to charge more and more for them because now we're starting to collect data on what's working and what's not. Now when I go out to a new client, I can say, “Hey you know our mid-level package is $3900 a month, but here's the list of things you get and then here's kind of what are our current clients have seen as far as a return and a growth in their business based on what it is that we're doing.” That was a huge one for us.
Matt Coffy: Yeah it's funny how were literally like two months from that refresh where we had the same issues and we have a lot of piece mail, but most of the clients to work with we've got the data now and we can go back and give them some pretty relevant stuff from a perspective of changing out landing pages and the AB testing we've done and all the things that kind of add up, and especially if you hit certain verticals. I’ve always had that challenge and that's been one of the things that we've danced around is do you pick a vertical or do you basically do what we've done which has been “Hey winner come all.” We have so many just local clients just see our reputation. They just want to work with us. They’re like “You guys seem like you know what you're doing. Why don’t you do our stuff?” We haven't turned necessary a lot of people down but our abilities to really concentrate is going to be I would say not as focused. It went down some really specific verticals. It's tough because at one end we don't mind taking a $35 million manufacturing company that's going to really work with us and provide us with some enhanced knowledge base because they're going to make us actually work harder. But the end of the day we still have to sort of put these packages together like you've done and think about just really what can you take advantage from a data set that you already know about right. So you have an inherent advantage over another player that might be in the space.
Stephen Christopher: Yeah absolutely. Actually the CEO of Fathom, Scott Lowry I talked quite a bit, and that's one of the things we talked a lot about is how far down do you niche?
[clickToTweet tweet="'One of the big things that drove our revenue was putting together a solid product.' @StephenMChris" quote="'One of the big things that drove our revenue was putting together a solid product.' -Stephen Christopher"]
Matt Coffy: Yeah.
Stephen Christopher: And when do you start to say no, and one of the things that we've had multiple conversations about is you niche to the point of where your best abilities and skills are. So you take the things that you're really great at as a team and a culture and a company and lay out what all those are. So for example you know we're really great at organic SEO. We're really great at follow up through landing pages and email marketing and phone call tracking. So you take all the things that you're really good at currently and now you go out and you find industries that fit within those areas where you have expertise in and then that's where you start to market and that's how we've niched as based on that as opposed to what I used to do. I think a lot of agencies do is they kind of want to take anything and everything. But what we found is when we started niching down even more now we’re able to charge more still a very fair price to both parties but we're able to charge more and we’re known a little bit more as kind of the expert in certain industries. So now we have the ability to turn people down but yet still grow. That's been really big for us as well.
Matt Coffy: When you say you are marketing yourself, were you running ads? So one of the things that we've never done, which is surprising—I think most people would go “Really?”—is that we've actually never promoted ourselves. We've never gone out to Facebook and run ads. We've never gone on to pay per click ads. We've never done anything. We’ve literally just taken clients on because of the demand in the market. Did you go down a niche and vertically go after the let's just say HVAC guy or the chiropractor guy or whatever and say “Let's run a targeted campaign and let's market ourselves”? Was that part of the business strategy to pick up customers that way or is it more, more direct sales type of activity?
Stephen Christopher: Yeah, ours was the same as yours. It was all organic referrals and just kind of me being out there in front of our ideal clients. It's really funny. We’re a digital agency, right? We run other ads for companies and we’re really good at it, but in the last probably maybe two months or so we've tried to start doing like some Facebook ads for us and we fail miserably at it. Marketing for a digital agency is not one of our strengths, and so were we were having trouble marketing our own services through some of the mediums that we do really well for other clients. To answer your question, no, we've never done it we've tried a little bit and we've been unsuccessful. So most of what we do is just add so much value to our ideal client that eventually they want to come work with us. I'll speak at events that have a group of clients that we want or put out videos with just information on how to grow a chiropractic practice or how to grow your HVAC business, things you should be doing, things that your SEO company should be doing to watch out for. We just answer the questions that they have and then that kind of organically turns into business, and then on the other side we just do a great job. Everybody in the chiropractic industry has other chiropractors in other areas as friends, so if we do a great job for them, now you're going to get referrals from that.
Matt Coffy: No question. Same with us. I was just curious because we had considered this whole process of how do we expand and you're right. I think the B2B strategy in the digital marketing world has been really —and I've talked to even our AdWords team and they're like “Don't do it.” The issues is that you will get clients but they're not going to be the right fit because they're there they're shopping in the wrong direction. They’re shopping from typically a low-cost alternative because they're not educated enough, and the ones that are educated they tend to once they get educated they tend to go and then get the reference point. They’re like “Hey I need to do this XYZ. Hey, who are you working with?” Right? I think that that's been the predictor for us. But from a general standpoint, I find that people who find us naturally from an SEO perspective it's just, as you mentioned growing yourself organically, it seems to be those clients stick around the longest because they want to have the same sort of level up marketing strategy, and they don't have to pay for somebody. They don't have to put $6000 down a month to pay for a marketing manager and have a seat for them and have a computer and deal with them when they are out sick. It's a very interesting model that and I always wonder what's the motivation behind this. I was thinking about this today. I mean was talking about mantras and mantras relate to obviously your personal commitments to yourself. I was thinking that one of the things is to talk to customers and get them enthused about the possibilities of building out their business, not necessarily solving the problem. Not “Here, you do AdWords and you do SEO and you do social media and you do this email marketing.” I think that’s all part of the mechanics but really to speak with someone and get them enthused about growing their business and giving them their life back in a way would be sort of a very interesting paradigm to work from a mantra.
Stephen Christopher: Yeah. I love that. We've seen some success kind of around what you're talking about. Actually I watched a video that you did. I don't know what it was dated. But it was about pretty much like your why, finding your why, why are you doing what you're doing. I think that ties in with exactly what you're saying. If you can find out why your customer is doing what they're doing, why did you start a business, why are you trying to grow it, is it to send your daughter to college, is it to allow your family to go on more vacations. Whatever that is for your customer, if you can start with that and then work backwards and showing them how you're going to help them get there, I think that's how you build an unbelievable customer relationship and now they're so excited about doing the work when we asked them to do the stuff. We all know clients don't always enjoy doing. It’s like “Hey, remember, John. Remember by you writing this or by you doing this video, that's helping Sally get to college. That's what we're trying to do for you.” Now all of a sudden he's excited again and more willing to do those things that maybe they don't see the exact correlation in the beginning.
Matt Coffy: So when you split out of your previous agency, what was the size of that agency and what was the motivation for you to split from that agency?
Stephen Christopher: Yes. So from 2009 to 2014, so about five years, we had grown too I think we're just shy of 15 people, but we were only doing on average between like $40,000 and $60,000 a month. So we had grown what I would consider to be a little more sluggishly. We were pretty fat as a company. I mean we weren't running real lean, so we're kind of just trying things and see what works and we didn't really use our cash all that well. The reason for leaving was I had a 50-50 business partner and we had different ideas of what you do when you start to become successful. So when we started to actually make some money, my theory on running a company is that you reinvest, you work even harder, you grow more so that now you can create more jobs, you can help more staff accomplish what they want, and you can help more clients accomplish what they want. My business partner’s idea was that CEOs don't really work and they just kind of hang out and watch the money roll in. So over a couple months we slowly just over conversations just realized that we weren't a great fit as partners anymore. I tried to buy him out for a few months and it just didn't work, so I ended up selling at the last minute which was a huge blessing in disguise.
Matt Coffy: Interesting. So now motivation to start your own show. I get it. Put the pieces together and get started. But still that foothold to get to around $80,000 thousand a month within a year or two years was—I guess I go back to my original opinion of this motivations. Is there a motivation behind that? Meaning that what gets you up in the morning just to do it? I don't mean it in a negative way. I mean obviously there's a lot of mental torsion here as we kind of go through each day because we talked about this in the beginning before you started, this up and down mental roller coaster. What do you think is behind—and we talked about this just a few minutes ago—your why since we're on that topic?
Stephen Christopher: I mean besides just living an entrepreneur lifestyle and being a glutton for punishment apparently as we all know as business owners, really I mean my why is to do absolutely whatever it takes to help business owners achieve success that they never thought possible. To me, that that alone wakes me up in the morning. I mean that does everything for me in my in my life, so that gets me to have a better relationship. That gets me to the gym. That gets me to working on my company culture. That gets me to sell. I mean for me there's no greater purpose in my life than to help business owners achieve success, and I'm doing that through one of the things that I'm good at it which is the digital marketing space. I mean that's a big part of it for me is just knowing my why, and when I'm sitting there maybe doing something that I know I'm not supposed to be or kind of slacking off, that pops up in my mind that I say “Oh man, like what am I doing here?” We literally have one life like that minute that I just wasted or that hour that I just wasted I can never get that back again. Why wouldn't I want to use it doing something that is going to move me closer to that why or help one of our clients? So when I put the whole thing in perspective meaning like our whole life and our time here, whatever that means to each individual person, you're sitting at the office no matter what pretty much, right? I mean as owners we’re in the office every day or you're working every day if you work from home. You're sitting in front of your computer. Why not do the thing that is going to get you to that next level? It's really no more difficult than been messing around or kind of floundering in some fake projects that just because you want to play on Facebook today you're like “Oh man maybe we'll just play with Facebook ads.” Like you know deep down that that's not what you need to be doing. But doing that the right project is really no more difficult. It doesn't take any more energy. So just do the right thing. One of my friends, coaches, mentors always says, “Do what's right, not what's easy.” I have that written on my wall. I mean for me that's the motivation is I know what my why. I know that we're here on this planet for a finite amount of time and I know that there's a lot of stuff out there to experience still, and if I'm not willing to work my butt off, I'm not going to see all that stuff. I'm going to miss it and I don't want to do that. I want to help as many people as I can and I want to experience as much as I can while I'm here.
Matt Coffy: So let's talk about that. You have a couple of interesting clients. You work with Hal Elrod, right?
Stephen Christopher: Yeah and that's actually the guy I was talking about, his “Do what's right, not what's easy.”
Matt Coffy: I know. I recognize it.
Stephen Christopher: I love it.
Matt Coffy: How did you get hooked up with him? Because he's a pretty well-known author. He's been sort of on his book. I guess it's not even like a tour but it is sort of a tour because he is everywhere and he's doing a lot of the traditional folks that we know have events. How did you get hooked up with him? I'm just curious. As a friend or was it a relationship you had?
Stephen Christopher: Yes so here's the cool thing about social media in today's world. I was at an event. Somebody told me about this book called the Miracle Morning and it was written by this guy named Hal Elrod. I went home. I read the book. I was like “Man, this is awesome.” I just reached out to him on Facebook and this was this was really right at the time when I started Seequs, so early 2014, reached out to him on Facebook. I researched him first, asked him a couple questions about things he was working on so that it wasn't like I was just trying to take advantage of his time and just asked for a phone call. I was like “Hey, man. I'd really love to jump on the phone with you for like 10 minutes.” I had a couple of very specific questions that I wanted to ask him, so it wasn't time wasted. So he finally said yes. I had asked him a couple times. He said yes and we created kind of a very loose friendship over Facebook, and I said, “Hey if you ever come to Denver and do a speaking event, let me know. I'd love to attend it.” He said, “Hey I'm actually going to be there in a couple weeks. I'm speaking at a private event, but if you want to come as my guest, you come and hang out and I can meet you.” So I mean that's really how we got started and then we continued talking after that and he was starting to get much bigger I mean pretty much by the month at this point from Miracle Morning sales and speaking and keynoting and stuff. So I said, “Tell me more about your coaching program.” And so I hired him as a coach so that I could basically talk to him every two weeks. Sometimes you have to invest money to build your circle of influence and the people around you. So it's funny we kind of joke about it. Over the last two years we've actually become really good friends. We attend a lot of the same events. He puts on an event called Best Year Ever Blueprint in December. I spoke on that stage the last couple years and have really gotten to know those people within his group, and he's introduced me to some people kind of in the next level of group actually, including people like Cameron Harold. That's just kind of how it built in and we joke now. I mean I won't talk about his fees, but his coaching fees, his one-on-one coaching fees have grown by like 300 or 400 percent since I hired him two years ago. He always tells me like “We don't really need to do coaching.” I was like “No I want my time with you every two weeks.” So I still pay him as a coach when I started two years ago. So I told him if nothing else I pay him for his time so we can catch up.
Matt Coffy: Do you think that that the coaching from Hal has been one of the reasons why you've been able to grow so quick? I'm getting back to the motivation.
Stephen Christopher: Yeah. I think it has. Hal helped me a lot with just what I would consider to be the personal development side, working on yourself, and I think that's helped a lot with the business because I think we have to be really clear on what we're doing in order to really make massive growth within a business or influence other people especially like our staff and our clients. So yeah I fully believe that my coaching with Hal has had a huge impact on myself which I believe has had a huge impact on the business.
Matt Coffy: Is there something with Hal that you feel that resonates with you more than other coaches? You could pick a lot of mentors and typically to pick a mentor that's in the same framework like another larger agency but you picked guy who was a Miracle Morning dude.
Stephen Christopher: We share a lot of very similar experiences in life now not necessarily his car crash that he experienced. I didn't go through that. But we both went through really big highs, really big lows, I mean experience depression and also success on the flip side of that, and he's only about a year, actually he's almost exactly you're older than me. I tell him, “Hey just go experience what I need to experience next year and then tell me now so I can skip a year.” That's been really beneficial so having him have gone through things just like the depression type thing and failure of a business and now he went through the process of figuring out how to deal with that and now I'm able to shortcut my learning curve there. So the similar experiences is what really resonated or made the relationship between Hal and I resonate and why I think we get along so well. I appreciate all he's done for me as well.
Matt Coffy: Yeah I think finding the right mentor has been that a challenge for me. I want to actually be with some very high-end guys but then when you look at the price tag, you’re like “I don't know if I can rationalize that.” because they have kind of grown to a certain degree or some of the main guys where it's the 25,000 question. Is it going to change me that much? I think that you have to think where you want to put percentages of your income. A lot of people have also mentioned that it's more than the mentoring. It’s the network. You probably hit it on the head which is that Hal’s getting you potentially even closer to people like a Cameron Harold who was that's us next level right. The question is where do you make that choice and what made you go in that direction? Was that just because of the fact that you connected with him? I mean I have done the same thing. I'm not saying that it's unique, but it is very true that if you want to reach out to someone there is a way to do it and that most people are accepting.
Stephen Christopher: Yeah, a lot of people feel like “Oh they're never going to have time for me so they never do it.” But it's pretty easy to get a hold of most people. As far as some of your comments about the money, I mean the money and who? So as business owners and even just people, we don't want to waste money. So we're sometimes afraid to spend it I think in in coaching and mentoring especially when you start looking at price tags of $2500, $3500, $5000 a month and things like that and then attending events for 5 grand, 10 grand, 15 grand whatever those look like. I'll be transparent I mean I think last year I don't know exact but I know that I spent somewhere between $55,000 and $70,000 last year on coaching events. Some of that includes events that I'll send my staff to but probably have a pretty small amount of that was for that. I spend a lot of money in coaching and being around the people that I want to be around and that has had a really big impact for me. As far as picking the right one, that's a tough one I guess. I interview those people a lot and it just has to feel right. Some of the coaches I have interviewed I'll actually talk to their other coaching clients and say, “Hey this is what they're telling me. Give me your real hard numbers of what's been happening and what has changed in your business in the last six months or the last 12 months by working with this person.” If you can do it for two or three other companies, then heck yeah. We get along and I like your philosophies and I feel like you're right I guess just really a good person, then hey let's give it a shot.
Matt Coffy: I think that's a part of the challenge. I mean the way I look is do I pick a really high-end, over qualified employee that I could bring in that could have that impact the same time or do I go out and get a coach? Those are my biggest arguments mentally. I could get a really top end person that is like off-the-charts capable of helping me grow the business really from an agency level or do I invest in a coach who will give me the mental motivational. It's a seesaw to say the least because it's hard to find really talented people in this industry that fit you culturally as well.
Stephen Christopher: I mean you hit the nail on the head right there. I mean I think that's so important and I think it's so overlooked. It's got to fit culturally because you can bring in the top guy or girl and whatever paid, and if they aren't a culture fit, then they're pretty much I mean they're close to worthless because the culture is going to get rid of them, and if they can't be happy at work they're not going to do their best work. Now you've spent all this money and you haven't gotten their highest value from that money. From our experience or from my experience so far I've had this discussion with myself and a lot of other people is do we just you know do I just kind of suck it up and hire somebody really good in this area because that's kind of where I want to grow. I've talked to some really big agency owners because they have years of data and millions of dollars invested/maybe even wasted on doing this type of stuff. The feedback that I've gotten consistently is higher low to mid-level people that fit the culture in the team that are really hungry and willing to grow, that's where they've consistently gotten the best value. I've had more than one place tell me “Hey we hired the best of the best and it didn't work.” I don't know from experience. Personally we have never brought in like that best of the best person but only because I've asked so many people the question and that's consistently the answer I've gotten.
Matt Coffy: It's interesting. It is a knife blade. You just don't know until you get engaged on what the hunger level is. Because I'm very fascinated with 10xing this business. It's all I think about is like how do we get out of this percentage increase of x percent and look at a 10xing. What is that? I always feel if I had the time to step away from the agency and think about the models more cohesively instead of being day-to-day kind of hands deep into the stuff that I would have an ability to consider some options on business models, but again it takes a tribe to run the businesses, and by being the chief you really do need to be engaged at a certain level that just as you mentioned in part of your reasons for leaving your past agency you can't sit on your laurels and expect the business to continue to thrive without leadership.
Stephen Christopher: Yeah so true and you mentioned one of my favorite words. I mean I invest a lot in leadership, both me and like my operations manager here and other people that I that want to be groomed into a next level within the company. Leadership is just a huge part of I think why we've grown and why we're continuing to grow. I mean you mentioned 10x. It’s funny you mention that. We’re just finishing writing our vivid vision which is from Cameron Harold in Double Double and the vision of where the company will be on that December 2019, so three years from now and that's our actual goal. We're going to 10x what we're doing. So when we close December 2019, we will have done 10 million that year, so we have our work cut out for us over the three and a half years.
Matt Coffy: That's an awesome goal. That's something I think that you…and I know that the planning for that growth is hard to visualize these things but you don't really need to right now try and you know mechanically put the things all in place. You need to just operate off of the different sectors of a timeline that's a short time right now to build scale scalable capabilities. I think where we're all learning that the real business is to impart the wisdom from others that have got scalable and workable systems that don't need to be customized on every single thing. It needs to be driven from a simplistic almost line order type of model that delivers consistency, and then once you get there, then you can deliver the leverage by going out and doing the different mechanical pieces.
Stephen Christopher: Yeah when you when you have a strong enough why, the how will show up.
Matt Coffy: That's great. Alright so let's wrap this up. We've been on for about 30 minutes, 35 minutes. Is there anything that you want to impart to the person who is listening right now or any speaking event or anything that's coming up that's of interest that you'd like to highlight?
Stephen Christopher: I mean no real event coming up or anything. The biggest thing that I would say and leave people with is I think fear is one of the big things that holds us back from growing. I know that's what has held me back in the past, just kind of remembering that business is fun. Business is supposed to be fun. We're supposed to be enjoying this and we can't get caught up in the fear of what if all the time. The things that we want to accomplish are capable because we can look out there and see all the people that have done them. All these other CEOs of other agencies and owners I mean yes they're extremely intelligent, but they've been through all the stuff that we've been through, and they're just a little further ahead of that growth curve but they are no smarter than we are. They are no more talented than we are. Just remember that in and enjoy the ride to get there and that you that we can actually do it. I mean we talked a little bit about motivation. That's what motivates me. I mean if I can leave the group that the group of the audience with anything, that's probably the most important thing I would say.
Matt Coffy: The fear muscle.
[clickToTweet tweet="'You niche to the point of where your best abilities and skills are.'@StephenMChris" quote="'You niche to the point of where your best abilities and skills are.' -Stephen Christopher"]
Stephen Christopher: Yeah. Just remember business is supposed to be fun. I believe that the universe is set up that were all supposed to win, and the only time we don't win as when we get in our own way and we cause ourselves to not win. So by knowing that we're supposed to win and it's supposed to be fun and remembering that fear, I mean this will take 30 seconds. Fear is essentially fake. It’s an emotion we were given 200,000 years ago as cave people for survival, but our brain has not changed that much in the last 200,000 years so we still have this this emotion of fear that's ingrained in us as humans. But now since we don't have the need for survival really because we all have everything we need to survive, we still have fear. That's why like the fear of public speaking, you're afraid of it because you literally think you're going to die. Your brain is telling you “Hey if you do that, like you're going to die.” So that's why that fear so strong. So just knowing that a lot of times this emotion of fear is fake, it does not serve us in today's world and then combining that with things like hey they've done this. The other person has done this. I know it's possible. Let's have a little bit of fun along the way and not worrying about every little thing those are huge takeaways that I think about all the time and I think that it's really helped us grow as quickly as we have. So hopefully that makes a little bit a little bit more clarity around the takeaway that I was trying to give.
Matt Coffy: No it totally does. It's been an awesome interview. Certainly I'm sure we'll have other discussions because I think we're very close to the same I guess you can say cut of thread or same fabric, so we'll probably end up having another conversation at some point because I’ve got some other questions. But I'll save that for me for episode number two as we watch each other's growth.
Stephen Christopher: Yeah absolutely. Let's definitely keep in touch and kind of push each other to continue to grow.
Matt Coffy: Alright Steve. Appreciate it and I will catch you soon.
Stephen Christopher: Yeah. Thanks so much, Matt.
Matt Coffy: Yeah, take care.
Stephen Christopher: Okay.